Rockhard interview with Paul

Information

Date: June 2004
Source: Rockhard
Interviewed: Paul
Translation: English translated from German by Loeki

Interview

All the important things
For one long year Germany's most successful Rockband completely disappeared of stage. Recently the DVD "Lichtspielhaus" (cinema) came out, but the actual concentration of the six musicians of RAMMSTEIN only and alone was reserved for the next studio album. Short after Easter guitarist Paul Landers gave us an exclusive interview and gave away all worth knowing about the upcoming album, problems in the band, their relationship with Vladimir Klitschko and their attempt to converse a cannibal into a song.

Rockhard:Paul, where are you exactly?Paul:"At home, in Berlin. Just before Easter we flew back to Germany from Stockholm where we are recording our new album. Our producer and our mixer have family and children. Therefore they just wanted to take a break and go home for Easter."

Rockhard:Did you like this short break, or was it an unpleasant interruption in a creative phase?Paul:"We are also family-people; so we didn't find the break hard to take at all. Olli (Riedel) loves to surf and tries to spend each free minute at the sea in order to jump there on a board when he gets the chance. He has spent Easter at the Ostsee, and now we are on the verge to leave for Stockholm again."

Rockhard:Before we start to talk about Stockholm and the new album, I gladly would talk about the past.Paul:"ok, well the name of the band comes from... (laughs)."

Rockhard:Did you listen more often to your past albums lately - in particular "Mutter"?Paul:"Not so long ago, when we were in the middle of the pre-production, I bought myself a MP3- player and downloaded our albums. Then I went into town and listened all day long to all the songs we ever made."

Rockhard:Did you notice that at the time of your debut "Herzeleid" the whole world philosophized about that unbelievable guitar sound, but the true sound miracle "Mutter" quickly was taken for granted?Paul:"At this moment I don't know what is better and what is worse. Fact is at least that Herzeleid sounds rough. Mutter however sounds more "made," more produced. However Herzeleid was at that time in a more extreme position than Mutter was years later. You can't leave out the release dates of both albums. Mutter appeared in a time (2001 - wrm), in which many other guitar bands made albums, which sounded just as good as or even better than our songs. Therefore Mutter did not enter as such a milestone in history. Afterwards, I find Herzeleid rather soft and sweet. Nowadays I don't think: Wow, what a great sound!"

Rockhard:Jacob Hellner was your producer was from the beginning. Let's exaggerate it: If he hears his achievement on Mutter, he has to be ashamed for his work on Herzeleid.Paul:"He has learned exactly the same lesson as we did and he delivered the best capable work he could at that time. We all did the best we could. It's like when I see an old photo of me, I am ashamed for the clothes I'm wearing on it. Then I think: Man, what were you thinking...? It's hard cause I already know now that in three years, I will also be ashamed for the clothes I wear today and really like now. That's the way it goes."

Rockhard:So, that's the same with your sound?Paul:"Exactly. First one thinks: Man-o-man! The same thing the Beatles in former times thought, after they heard their four-trace recordings. Exactly the same happens with us. If we hear our new Songs today, we are totally carried away by the sound and we think: Hammer! In ten years however the album will stand in the oldies department of the record stores."

Rockhard:That means that with Mutter you could not repeat your past success in the USA and you had to start all over again.Paul:"Not from the scrap. We had, in the course of our second album Sehnsucht, a giant success with the single Du Hast. This single did great in the USA, and we had much more success than we ever could imagine ourselves. This success we accepted as given and thought: Everything is done, America lies at our feet! Later we were surprised that Mutter didn't sell that great. First we thought that we had to play more often over there. So we did. Then a certain person, who had taken care of us in a fantastic way so far, left our American Record company. This person was like totally infected by us and our sound and therefore so valuable to us. England however, showed us that it also can go the other way: there Mutter was our most successful album of all. All in all it was surely helpful for us to experience that it can go not only uphill, but also downhill. We could bear the decrease in America very well however, because in Europe it went very well."

Rockhard:Isn't it true that for rock bands in the USA very often applies: from the eyes, from the heart?Paul:"No, because the small but close Rammstein fan community is still there and the same as before. In Europe we have established ourselves. In the states we still are seen as something exotic, like a kind of secret tip, a recommendation, with a certain, firm basis. And this basis consists about 2,000 people per concert. The people, which go beyond this basis, belong to the column "from the eyes, from the heart"."

Rockhard:What did you do on Eastern Sunday around, let's say, around half past four?Paul:"Wait, I can tell you that exactly. I dreamed about a camel."

Rockhard:So you didn't in sat front of the TV watching heavyweight boxes?Paul:"Klitschko? nooh, I did not."

Rockhard:I ask you this 'cause your hit Sonne was originally meant as "entry-hymn" for Vladimir Klitschko.Paul:"Yeah, but he thought that that the Song was too hard.

Rockhard:Was the song itself really too hard, or is RAMMSTEIN according to Klitschko a bad, angry band, maybe a bit devilish?Paul:"Ha, maybe that means that perhaps Klitschko is too dear? (laughs). We had worked it all out, it was totally beautiful: The whole arena continues to count out - one, two, three, to ten, and then, exactly with "out!" Klitschko comes into the arena and goes in to the ring. At the moment, when he raises his arms the refrain rings out: "hier kommt Die Sonne". It was planned just like that."

Rockhard:The idea was super anyhow.Paul:"Yes, the idea was good. He should have gone through with it, perhaps then he didn't suffer any defeats like he does now. What his last fight concerns: I think someone mixed something into its water."

Rockhard:Perhaps it was simply only fear, what paralyzed him a little.Paul:"No, he was nevertheless obviously not completely in shape."

Rockhard:Or it was fear of the own courage.Paul:"Maybe he has no courage at all, for what he could have fear. Oh, I do not know. Perhaps someone, who thinks RAMMSTEIN is too hard, is too soft for boxing. He is too weak."

Rockhard:Was "Sonne" developed specially because of Klitschko?Paul:"Yes, if he hadn't given this opportunity at that time, the song wouldnt exist in this way. When the request came, Till (Lindemann) sat down and described the topic boxing in such a way with words that made the topic "boxing" less shallow. And so the song developed in the rehearsal room"

Rockhard:And if such a request was given by ice hockey, football or Wrestling?Paul:"oh no, we already did like the Klitschkos. We think they are good. I also think that the two brothers still have a career ahead of them."

Rockhard:Besides the unpleasant history Sonne remained one of your best songs off all.Paul:"And that's why it didn't matter that it didn't work out with Klitschko. The song is good. We just thought: One cannot force anybody into its luck. If someone really wants to enter the ring on Tina Turners ' You're Simply The Best ', he is allowed to do that. It's also a good song (giggles).

Rockhard:And then a video clip with the large Snow-white and you six as small dwarves developed.Paul:"Yes, in general we try not to convert the text into a video. The video is not a translation of the text. The spectator still needs to see pictures to get the text, and by doing so, it will also create a further level, on which without pictures you will never get."

Rockhard:Does the 'Sonne'/Snow-white concept imply that you are not fixed content-wise and hard to figure out or does it show that the "mark" RAMMSTEIN has above all much to do with fantasy?Paul:"It shows that we are completely but beautifully mad. Before "Snow-white we had the idea that the six of us were sitting in an airplane, from which the atom bomb on Hiroshima was thrown."

Rockhard:You're kidding.Paul:"Well, First comes the refrain- "hier kommt die Sonne", after that the bomb drops. We would have shown it in a realistic way. The pilots, who flew those airplanes, are already dead. They took their own life, after they were completely broken down by their act."

Rockhard:One of the pilots called out directly after the dropping: "Oh, my God! What have I done?"Paul:"Right, by doing that he pilots have incurred the loss of their own life. Anyhow, we wanted to show, how six humans can do such a thing."

Rockhard:None of the music channels, especially those in the USA, would have shown that kind of video.Paul:"When you start making concepts, you can't think like that. First, you are committed to make a good video. You want to. Whether it will be shown on television, is the second question. Anyway, it was again one of many ideas, which we rejected in the long run. When going trough the ideas for a video, we ask ourselves if it is possible that the mass could misunderstand us and our request. Your reaction shows me that the audience would not have understood us. Well, at least I would have liked it, especially the contrast, when in the beautiful refrain the atom bomb explodes. Nobody escapes of an appropriate feeling when seeing that.

Rockhard:Definitely not. But the broad mass would have misunderstood you completely. They would have been indignant or even furious!Paul:"Exactly what everybody thinks. And that's why its nonsense.

Rockhard:What would have happened, if it had worked out with Klitschko? Did you have an idea in the drawer for this possibility?Paul:"No, I don't know, what would have happened then. Maybe we had developed it together with Klitschko. That would however have been really too bad, because we had enormous fun doing the snow-white story. The shooting took two days, and because we had no desire to drive home from Babelsberg in the late evening, we slept in the small dwarf house. A friend of us drove to the gas station and got us a crate with various beverages. Afterwards we locked ourselves in the studio and had a correct dwarf party in the dwarf house. In the "making of" part of the "Lichtspielhaus" DVD there is a part, in which Flake (keys - wrm) looks a bit confused and has some difficulties."

Rockhard:For a large part "Mutter" was recorded and developed in a little house at the Baltic Sea...Paul:"The songs develop in different places. But we usually drive to a place, in order to record them as preproduction. Like you put together all the notes you made. The last time the preproduction took place in Heiligendamm at the Baltic Sea."

Rockhard:The Baltic Sea seems to be very special to you, because already in GDR times you and your band Feeling B were always on the island Hiddensee to spent summer.Paul:"We still do that. There are only two possibilities of going away: Either you drive into the mountains or to the sea."

Rockhard:Did you, in the little house in Heiligendamm - thus close together -, got to know each other better then ever?Paul:"No. you really become acquainted with each other on tour, you can't get closer in any way. Like you live in a submarine. From time to time you emerge and play a concert (laughs)."

Rockhard:How did your new album develop? How can we imagine your new album, without hearing a tone?Paul:"In contrary to our past three albums the new album was written in another constellation. Those, which brought in many ideas in former times, took a step back this time, and those, who had less song ideas before, are more represented this time".

Rockhard:Who belongs to which group?Paul:"That's not important. It's important that the new album for reasons mentioned has another tone quality. And: In contrast to the last album we had much more fun making it this time. In addition we didn't go anywhere to write the songs this time, but we did the preproduction in Berlin.

Rockhard:Does this mean that you had only little fun while making Mutter?Paul:"Yes, Mutter wasn't really great fun. The famous third album, as always so beautifully said. In addition there were interhuman reasons. After eight, nine years the balance of power had shifted within the band. That happens in each band. Ritchie Blackmore stepped out, because he could not go trough with Jon lord anymore. Their discord and quarrels were refreshing for the listeners for many years, but sooner or later it will get too much for all who are involved, and finally one must step out."

Rockhard:But nobody has left RAMMSTEIN.Paul:"No, that didn't happen. But there was tension and stress between two people cause of problems with competence as well with over and underestimation. We had orientate again ourselves. Finally it also cracked. But - I knock on wood! - we got over it well, and so we could work on the fourth album with lots of fun."

Rockhard:I guess you won't like to tell the names of the two.Paul:"Correct. It can happen to everyone at times, because everyone lacks compassion and understanding from time to time."

Rockhard:Back to the tone qualities: Can you say that there is a big difference with Mutter"?Paul:"We still tried to embed the singing more into the music. Or differently said: The music is more than ever a manege, in which the singing becomes effective better. Like ten white tigers. A platform, an aircraft carrier for the words (giggles)."

Rockhard:Very lyrically expressed...Paul:"I try to find the best words. The airplanes anyhow must be able to start smooth (laughs). In addition there are fewer reefs on the album because the guitars are a bit different."

Rockhard:Rather like a guitar carpet?Paul:"I don't know either. Different somehow. There are people, who listened to it and said that the sound was actually the same as always. For me, the album is different from Mutter, and it probably also will be for the attentive Rammstein fan. Perhaps it might be the same sound for my granny, to her, each AC/DC song sounds the same. Whatever, for one it will sound differently, for the other the new songs sound exactly the same as always. And both parties are probably right."

Rockhard:For someone who estimates your achievement on Mutter very high, I am convinced that the new album can only become a disappointment. It is nearly impossible to take it up against Mutter or at least make an equal successor.Paul:"But I don't make an album to overrule the last one. I try to make each album a good album. That may sound boring, but your girlfriend does not end the relationship, because you have a better... Okay, maybe that's a bad example (laughs). Actually, you can find only one girlfriend, only one. If you are lucky, it is a good one, and if you have real bad luck she looks pretty, but is however totally nuts. A woman can be pretty, and every one thinks: Man, why does not remain together with her? But the woman is completely crazy. An album can sound also good, but it must also be fun to write this album. I often experienced that people, which are less successful in their work, work completely bitten and fun-free, just to have success. And those in contrast to people, who rather have fun and just roll into it all, mostly do good things. I have to say that I also met people, which have enormous success and still are totally relaxed. What can I say: Metallica also continued after their black album. You don't write a good album therefore, that you won't make another. You rather try to make each one a good album. To say it diplomatically: another album, another advancement."

Rockhard:Already some song titles as well as different album titles go around. Which of those titles actually exist?Paul:"First about the album. First it should be called Amore. After that it had to be Rosenrot. Then we came up with "Rot" ("red"). Until now it has no name, and we call her in the daily linguistic usage "Das Rotes Album" ("the red album"). Usually, we select the title after one of the songs on the album, but that's not the case this time. A song is called for example ' Stein um Stein '. Somehow, it doesn't fit as album title. So we are still searching for one. Oh, another song is called Rosenrot ('rose red')."

Rockhard:That must be about a woman...Paul:"It's about the fact that women always want something. And the man does it for her, although he knows that it's not good, -for both. But he does it nevertheless, and at the end he dies. What's left to tell? Ah, a song about Moscow is on it. And one about America."

Rockhard:Because both in Russia and in the USA you are waiting?Paul:"not necessarily. In the song Moscow it concerns particularly the city of Moscow. The America song is about our present relationship to America and the current situation. Many people are nagging about America, the opinion turned enormously against America lately - due to the perfect foreign policy of that country (giggles). On the other hand I took a look into my closet. There are four American jackets hanging in it. If you are nagging about the fact that the Americans interfere everywhere and are everywhere, then you should begin with yourself. It is true that America is everywhere. But in many cases it can only here or there, because it is wanted to be here or there. People ask for it. You're not forced to wear "Levi's" or eat at "Burger King". To that extent it concerns positives and negatives in one."

Rockhard:A topic, you could not imagine for the RAMMSTEIN of five years ago.Paul:"Yes, but the America song forced itself upon, because when we began the work on the album, the Iraq war just started. We could not avoid it. We did not search such a theme, on the contrary, but it was over present.
By the way: A further innovation is that on the upcoming album there is also sung in some Russian and some English. French is also an option, but we don't know any French yet. The album is not supposed to be international, but it is not hundred percent German either."

Rockhard:Russian is not so wrong at all.Paul:"Well, all is wrong and nothing is at all."

Rockhard:Russian fits Tills style very well.Paul:"We did not look for that on purpose. It simply resulted in such a way."

Rockhard:Richard Kruspe Bernstein, your guitarist colleague, said once in an earlier interview, that he wanted to make pop music with hard reefs. Pop music also means that you will reach a broad mass. When can you say, in the case of RAMMSTEIN, that a broad mass has been reached, and when can you tell when an album would be a flop in your eyes?Paul:"You have reached a broad mass if you look into the audience, and men with moustaches are standing there.
If an album is a flop, is defined differently by everyone. I don't look at sales figures that much. Michael Jackson has sold approx. 40 billion or 40 million copies of "Thriller". (laughs). The album created only eight million and therefore it was in his eyes and in the eyes of the media a flop. Eight million! That would be an absolute rocket for us. To that extent it is a matter of opinion, what you consider a flop."

Rockhard:Let's go back to the DVD "Lichtspielhaus". Personally find both the bank robbery video and the making of ' Ich Will ' quit impressing. This video required an enormous acting achievement. Did you had to practice for it, or did you develop certain self-dynamics during the shooting, cause noticed you that the video could become an absolute hammer?Paul:"Ha, if boys may play a shooting or robbery, they do not need to specially train for it! No, it went really easily, particularly since every one of us has some criminal tendencies in itself. But for a small part it was also hard: After this doing this video, I never will consider to rob a bank, because that SWAT team is genuinely violent! Richard told those guys that they had to make it look real. No sissy action. So I was thrown quit hard on the soil. I had a bloody nose directly with the first shooting. You do not see that in the video. Unfortunately the video was only shown on television for a short period, because it was released at a time, in which two airplanes flew into in the World trade centre. Therefore people didn't want to see a video, in which bank robbers take hostages. Osama was at place one, we could not overrule that."

Rockhard:How long did you guys need for the video?Paul:"one day of shooting in and around the GDR Council of State building."

Rockhard:What does such a video cost?Paul:"You're asking the wrong person. One thing is sure; our manager did some good negotiation and got us a good video budget from the record company. Normally a band gets around the 30,000 euro. We had maybe around 300,000 euro. I do not know that for sure, but I think it was that much. We had huge luck, because the contracts from times of peace still existed at that time, before the whole dilemma began with major."

Rockhard:Your bass player Olli says in the Making Of that the self-confidence, when it's concerns your own songs, has grown. Does that mean that there was indeed something fishy with your previous songs, with which you had unbelievable success?Paul:"No, we were simply six naive East Germans, who were released on trained journalists. And we tried clumsily to resist things which we would not have had to resist at all. If I read or hear our old interviews, I am always a little ashamed. On the other hand we really had no clue and we always meant the best. But it is embarrassing actually, from today's view.
If today people would accuse me, of something, like being radically right-wing, I simply will only giggle. Back then, I would have started a huge defensive speech. Something like: "But we... there and there... "
After these incidents, we first began to keep ourselves busy with it who we are, what we do or have done and where we to wanted to go. At the beginning we would simply only just begin, without thinking about what we do."

Rockhard:Ich will can be seen as some kind of tribute to that whole "being a Rock star" matter.Paul:"Right."

Rockhard:Other bands behave pretty vain on the stage, annoy with percussion instruments and try with "Heyheyhey!" - and "Ohohoho!" to get the public going and sing along. You intensified the whole thing, by making fun over this.Paul:"The song is typical for us, because it is again not meant to be ironical or maybe just a little! Of course we make fun of bands who try to start those sing along choirs. But we use it. We are also pleased, if people stand up, raise their arms and sing along. When we played Seemann for the first time, for us, at that time, it was terribly embarrassing to see that in the public lighters were moved. In the meantime we consider it okay, because it is just part of the deal. But there are different possibilities of "animation". You can place yourself like Robbie Williams or Fred Durst by the edge of stage and hold the hand by the ear, which I find totally repulsive. The same counts for things like: "Oh, this city here, Berlin. I love you; it is the best concert of the entire tour." That is just nasty bootlicking. But either the people don't notice that or they do not feel it as bootlicking. So it continues.

Rockhard:In general you do not talk on the stage.Paul:"A newsreader of a journal also says nothing between the contributions. He only presents the facts. That must be enough."

Rockhard:So RAMMSTEIN live means: Facts, facts, facts.Paul:"(laughs) We let the flames speak for us and should not say a thing. There are many bands, which do not talk. And there are bands, which I like cause they say a lot. For example Die Artze. There I find the announcements better than the music. When Farin talks, I am pleased."

Rockhard:Which influence do the world-wide events of the day and the morning view into the newspaper have on your songs and text ideas?Paul:"There are influences. We considered for example whether we should do something on our album about Armin Meiwes, to the cannibal of Rotenburg."

Rockhard:Meiwes was condemned, because he ate another man...Paul:"What did you say: Would you have condemned him?"

Rockhard:Yes, morally. Whether he is to be condemned legally, I do not know.Paul:"Morally? Not at all. Legally he will be condemned."

Rockhard:If you would ask me, to cook you and eat...Paul:"I would not do that."

Rockhard:But if. And if I accepted and would actually eat you. Then I would be a creature that should have been also condemned from the moral point of view...Paul:"Nevertheless you cook a chicken, and that chicken didn't even ask you for it. It's a little impudent: If two people decide something, like when one person asks "do you want to marry me?", and the other one says "okay!" no one may interfere as the third in their affairs. The two persons in this whole cannibal-story both agreed. And if they both got happy, I do not see a reason for me to interfere."

Rockhard:This is movie material.Paul:"If we would make a music video about this, we could take pieces from the original video, which was shown before court. But to get back at the theme: We can't imagine ourselves that there are people, who like it if someone pees all over them. Or that there are men, with leading positions in big companies who like being humiliated, degraded and whipped in a brothel. But it exists, and there are many more of those glaring things. And if one of those things gets out in the open, everyone is suddenly surprised. While such things are present always and everywhere."

Rockhard:And what if such a cannibal doesn't get any punishment starts to look for the next victim who will be killed and eaten against his will - and afterwards states that it happened in the mutual agreement?Paul:"He could get that confirmed in writing, maybe even by notarial deed before this takes place! Just like in the case of euthanasia, which by the way I endorse. I also think it that its idiocy that you are obliged to buckle the seat belt in the car. Whether someone wants to buckle the seat belt or not, is up to themselves. Generally I think is crazy, prescribing security. Everyone should do as he or she pleases. Of course I'm not talking about speed limiting in dangerous places. If someone is that stupid to go way too fast around the curve, he should be punished for it. But if he does not want to buckle up the seat belt, he should have the right to die at the tree.
Or traffic lights at the road: I never in my life signed anything, in which I agreed and obliged myself that I may go when the light is green and remain standing when red. I find it impudent that I must adhere to these rules. In former times there was a forest here, in which I could run freely. Today there is a road with a traffic light. Actually each citizen would have to swear an oath at the beginning of his life: "I am determined to subordinate me ." Instead one is born and gets told: "so, now you have to go along and do as we say! Join the army and get yourself shot for us! Pay taxes and remain standing when red."

Rockhard:Were you in the army?Paul:"No, I did not have the time. But I pay many taxes. If I get two "apples" from my Record Company, I must hand over one "apple" immediately."